TRANSCRIPT - ABC Afternoon Briefing with Greg Jennett

PAUL FLETCHER MP

Shadow Minister for Science and the Arts

Shadow Minister for Government Services and the Digital Economy

Manager of Opposition Business in the House

TRANSCRIPT

ABC Afternoon Briefing 

7 NOVEMBER 2024

Greg Jennett: Well, as we've been covering, the new Trump Administration will have huge impacts within the US clearly and internationally. We'll touch on that and more now with Liberal frontbencher and our regular guest on the program Paul Fletcher. Paul, welcome back. There's so many questions that we could ask about Donald Trump. But broad one that relates to Australia though. Does the Coalition take heart from his victory because it provides pointers to the pathway for recovery for the Liberal and National parties in this country? 

Paul Fletcher: Look, I think those parallels can be overstated. The US system is very different, voluntary voting and so on. But I think what we did see was, the winning campaign was one very much focused on cost of living issues. Do you feel better off? And certainly cost of living, we think, will be a very significant theme in the next election. When you've seen inflation go up as it has, RBA projecting 3.5% for next year, we know the cost of food is up 12%, cost of gas is up more than 30% we know 12 interest rate rises in a row. These are issues that are very tangible in people's lives and certainly that will be a focus we believe in the next election.

Greg Jennett: And do you target accordingly? I mean, as you take something like the recent Queensland election result, the LNP picking up seats in places like Gladstone and Rockhampton, which I believe they've never held before. And you look at some of the inner urban trends that went on in the US yesterday. Does that mean you recalibrate effort to places like the Illawarra, Geelong, the Hunter? 

Paul Fletcher: Look, I take a couple of things. First, I think arguments from US geographical distribution to Australian are very different. Let's not forget that, we have about two thirds of our population urbanised. Of course, the third that are not in our cities, very important Australians. And the Coalition speaks up for them very strongly. But we speak to speak up for every Australian. And there's a universality about issues of cost of living and inflation. This assumption that they only affect some Australians, I think is quite wrong. 

Greg Jennett: All right. The Prime Minister secured his first phone call with the President elect today. I'm going to assume that was the product of some detailed preparation work by Kevin Rudd and the Washington Embassy team. Do you take that phone call as evidence of the fact that everything's going to be okay for Team Australia in Washington? 

Paul Fletcher: Let's be clear, the Coalition strongly supports Australia having a close, effective relationship with the Trump Administration. It's of course, the US is our largest security partner, very important economic partner. But there's no doubt that the Albanese Labor Government is starting on the back foot with personally critical comments of President Trump, from Mr. Albanese, from a range of other Labour frontbenchers and of course, from our Ambassador, Kevin Rudd. Now we want Kevin Rudd to be successful as Australia's Ambassador, as Simon Birmingham, our Foreign Affairs spokesman has made clear. But there's no doubt that Labor is starting from behind the eight ball. 

Greg Jennett: What evidence would you have to see to cause you concern, or to reach the conclusion that Kevin Rudd's tenure there is no longer viable? 

Paul Fletcher: Well, let's focus on achieving outcomes that are in Australia's best interests. It takes hard work. The former Coalition Government did this, for example, when then-President Trump imposed tariffs on steel and aluminium from around the world, and the then Liberal Prime Minister, Malcolm Turnbull, was able to secure a special carve out for Australia. So you can achieve these outcomes with hard work, and that work is very important in Australia's national interest. 

Greg Jennett: Alright, let's push on. I mean, we could talk all day about what's gone on in the US, remarkable series of events there. Age verification, the government's announced today that it will move on with the legislation. Some verification details are still the product of a still to be completed trial. Do you believe this is going to be truly effective, though? Because in the 14-15 year old age group, many of these teens are on social media with the acquiescence of their parents. Do you actually believe they're going to give these up? 

Paul Fletcher: Well, the first thing is the Coalition supports this. In fact, Peter Dutton in June of this year said that this would be a Coalition commitment, an age limit of 16, for going on social media and requiring the platforms to have verification technology in place. And he said if we came to government, it would be his priority in the first 100 days. So we welcome the fact that the Albanese Labor Government is taking an approach consistent with what we've committed to. Now, on the question of is it technically viable? I would just say in my time in Parliament, including as Communications Minister, as a Parliamentary Secretary to Communications Minister, I've done a lot of work in this space. I might say that our Shadow Communications spokesman, David Coleman, is doing excellent work and making very, very sensible observations on these issues. He's made the point, and I agree with him completely that the platforms, if they choose to, certainly can apply effective technology and in some cases they already do it for their own purposes. It should be a requirement and a condition of doing business in Australia. 

Greg Jennett: So you would drive full responsibility on to them. Does that mean you don't need these third party applications that might estimate my age?

Paul Fletcher: Let's wait and see exactly what the government proposes, and we'll comment on the workability of that once we see it. But David's made the point, and I would similarly make the point that we do see this technology in use already by the platforms in certain circumstances. It's not really a technical viability question. It's a question of their readiness to do it. And will they incur the cost to do it? But what the government is saying and we support them in that, is that this will be a legal requirement for doing business in Australia. Now, what I have consistently seen over more than ten years working in this policy space is that the platforms say all too hard. We can't do it. Australia will be a backwater. It won't possibly work. But if you have well-drafted legislation and you stick to your guns, you can get the outcome. So now it will be up to the government to see if they can draft workable legislation. 

Greg Jennett: Does Elon Musk strike you as the sort of individual, particularly now, who's going to want to comply with that? 

Paul Fletcher: Well, again, people have said this consistently. They said it about the News Media Bargaining Code. The Coalition managed to make that work against both Meta and Alphabet, so it can be done when there's sufficient focus and you get the technical details right. That will be the challenge for the current government. But let's be clear we support this. 

Greg Jennett: All right. Final one. Paul, we'll move across to High Court ruling only yesterday under cover of the US election about released immigration detainees. The government's rushing emergency laws. In effect they did that today, but they'll come back for debate a little later. That will deal with a couple of hundred NZYQ detainees. I guess you'll support that as you have before. The question is, what's with this constant cycle of passing unconstitutional laws, having them knocked down, then coming back with the patch up, are you happy as a Coalition just to cycle through with this perpetual series? 

Paul Fletcher: This was totally mishandled by the former Immigration Minister Andrew Giles. When the High Court brought down its decision in NZYQ last year. The consequence of that decision was that the High Court found that the immigration detention arrangements, which had been in place for some time, were not constitutionally valid. As a result, 12 murderers, 61 sex offenders and others released into the community. Then Minister Giles had made no preparations for the possibility of that decision coming down. He really sat there doing very little for several weeks until we pressed him to take action. 

Greg Jennett: You keep giving him a leave pass, though, with all these patch up Bills. 

Paul Fletcher: Well, the first best would have been that we weren't in that situation in the first place if Minister Giles had done his job. Because he didn't do his job, we came forward and worked with the government to pass legislation quickly, but none of it needed to have happened if Minister Giles had been competent in protecting our borders. Sadly, he wasn't.

Greg Jennett: All right. Well, Tony Burke's problem to fix now, I guess if he were here, he would assure us that he is on to that. And that will continue when Parliament comes back. Paul Fletcher, good to see you once again. 

Paul Fletcher: Thanks so much.