TRANSCRIPT - ABC Radio National with Steve Cannane

PAUL FLETCHER MP

Shadow Minister for Science and the Arts

Shadow Minister for Government Services and the Digital Economy

Manager of Opposition Business in the House

TRANSCRIPT

ABC Radio National with Steve Cannane

4 November 2024

Steve Cannane: Paul Fletcher is the Manager of Opposition Business in the House and he joins us ahead of what promises to be another big week in federal parliament. Paul Fletcher, welcome to the program.

Paul Fletcher: Good to be with you, Steve.

Steve Cannane: Thank you. The government wants to cut 20 per cent from every student’s debt. Debts that have been rising rapidly over the past decade, with almost 60,000 Australians now having student debts of over $100,000. Does the Coalition see any positive in that, in giving young people relief in that area?

Paul Fletcher: Well, the Coalition believes that this is a profoundly unfair policy. It will cost 27 million Australians. All 27 million Australians will be required to contribute to the cost of it, but 24 million Australians will not benefit from it. Let’s remember the underlying policy rationale for HECS going back to when it was introduced in the Hawke Keating years, which is that people who have the benefit of a tertiary education will have much higher lifetime earnings than the average across the community, and therefore it’s appropriate that they bear some of the cost of their education. The Commonwealth already pays around 60 per cent of the cost of a university student’s education. So there’s already a very significant amount being paid by taxpayers. What this will simply do is increase the burden on all taxpayers. This has to be paid for. There’s no such thing as a free lunch, but it’s also a reminder that we’re seeing the Prime Minister and Labor increasingly trying to use the Steven Miles tactics that we saw from Queensland Labor, which is trying to offer more and more free things. It suggests that they’ve really given up on the very important economic challenges that we have, particularly the challenge of getting inflation under control and addressing the cost of living crisis, which affects every one of the 27 million Australians.

Steve Cannane: Do you recognise there’s a problem with generational inequality in Australia at the moment?

Paul Fletcher: The fundamental issue of, for example, getting cost of living and inflation under control will benefit all Australians, regardless of which generation you’re in. One of the reasons that we’ve seen HECS indexation going up is because this government has let inflation get out of control and therefore indexed HECS payments are going up. Under the Coalition on average, HELP indexation was just 1.7 per cent. 

Steve Cannane: True but there was economic circumstances that were global and inflation did increase around the world, which was a different circumstance. But I want to bring you back to that.

Paul Fletcher: But when you look at that, right now, we know that interest rates and inflation are coming down in the United States, in the United Kingdom, in Canada and in New Zealand, but not in Australia. Mr Chalmers’ excuse that it’s global conditions does not explain why it is that most of the countries against which we would benchmark ourselves are now seeing interest rates and inflation coming down. That is what the Coalition is pointing out, that the Albanese Labor Government seems to have given up on the fight against inflation and the cost of living, which is causing so much misery to so many Australians.

Steve Cannane: Okay, on the issue of generational inequality, we have young workers increasingly cut out of the housing market. They’re shouldering a rising tax burden. They have bigger HECS debts than previous generations. And I’m wondering if that’s the case, why the Coalition would oppose debt relief for students and recent graduates, but then want to reverse the government’s tax concessions on balances, reverse the reductions on the government tax concessions on balances of superannuation over $3 million.

Paul Fletcher: We absolutely recognise that there are issues of concern to younger people that should be of concern to all of us, for example, getting into the housing market. That is why Peter Dutton, just a couple of weeks ago, announced a Coalition commitment of $5 billion for enabling infrastructure for new homes around the country. Because we know this is a very material constraint. So, yes, of course there are issues where we need to have particular concern to the needs of young Australians. One of them is housing. Unfortunately, under the present government, we are seeing new housing starts at a 10 year low. They dropped by over 8 per cent just in the last year. That’s why we are focused on targeted policies designed to support younger Australians, and it will be very significantly younger Australians who will benefit from the new homes that will be able to be built thanks to our $5 billion for additional housing enabling infrastructure.

Steve Cannane: Okay, just back to the student debt issues, that what was announced on the weekend is part of a broader series of changes to student debt, including lowering the indexation of student debt. Now they’re increasing the repayment threshold. Would the Coalition look at reversing those and clawing back that revenue? And as you point out, you know, you say that there is a small a large proportion of Australians paying for a smaller proportion of Australians here. Will you claw back that revenue if you win government?

Paul Fletcher: What we’re very clear on is that we want to get the cost of living and inflation down, because that benefits all Australians, including those Australians with a HECS debt, because the indexation on your HECS debt and therefore on your repayments is by definition linked to the inflation rate, the consumer price index. 

Steve Cannane: Okay, but are you going to reverse those changes?

Paul Fletcher: Look we’ve been clear on our position. We think that it is unfair to be imposing an extra $16 billion of cost on all taxpayers, all 27 million taxpayers, when 24 million taxpayers will not be benefiting from that. We absolutely recognise the issues facing younger Australians which is why, for example, we have committed to specific measures to deliver new housing and address the terrible mismanagement of housing that we’re seeing under this government with the lowest new housing starts in 10 years. 

Steve Cannane: Okay, and I should point out, those changes haven’t gone through the parliament yet. We’re talking to Paul Fletcher, the Manager of Opposition Business in the House. Let’s move on to the week in parliament. The Coalition wants the rule in force that says politicians must buy the cheapest practical fare when they fly. The data shows MPs are overwhelmingly flying Qantas. Are MPs including on your side, flouting that rule?

Paul Fletcher: Well, these are ultimately matters for the Department of Finance which imposes these policies. Certainly the Coalition is supportive of competition. We’re certainly supportive of competitive in aviation. That’s been one of the issues which got a lot of focus last week because we saw just over a year ago a proposal by Qatar, a well known Middle Eastern airline, to fly an additional 28 flights between Australia and its home base in the Middle East, which would have brought more competition and hopefully lower air prices for Australians. Unfortunately, the Albanese Labor Government did not support that and it was unclear why. Then the Transport Minister, Catherine King, gave multiple conflicting explanations. But of course, the book, which came out last week about Qantas, contained the allegation that Mr Albanese was very close to the former chief executive of Qantas. So close that he would personally call him to request upgrades on economy tickets that he’d booked for holidays. Now, that’s the allegation, and that’s certainly stimulated a lot of debate, because one of the reasons is it highlights the public policy importance of competition in aviation. 

Steve Cannane: And I think a lot of people listening right now would want competition in the aviation sector in Australia. And I’m going to put it to you. Why did the Coalition in 2018, when Qatar had a bid up bid to open more flights up into Australia, did Michael McCormack, the then Coalition Transport Minister, put that bid on hold for four years?

Paul Fletcher: Well, what we want to see is more competition. We want to see more.

Steve Cannane: Why didn’t you introduce competition back then when the Coalition Government had an opportunity to?

Paul Fletcher: And can I make this point. One of our focuses in government was building Western Sydney Airport, which will provide new competition in the aviation market, because for the first time, we will have two airports in Sydney. At the moment, we know there’s a constraint on availability of slots in Sydney that makes it hard for new entrants to come in. Now, Mr Albanese was Transport Minister for six years. He did nothing to get Western Sydney Airport going. It took the Coalition to get it going. So we’ve got a strong track record of standing up for competition in aviation and that’s the important public policy issue here. How do we stimulate competition, give Australians more choice and get prices of air tickets down?

Steve Cannane: But you’re making the argument now that the Albanese Government maybe should have opened up competition to Qatar back in 2022, something that you didn’t do as a government back in 2018.

Paul Fletcher: On the merits of what was before the government in 2023, it’s not surprising that there were lots of questions being asked about why Mr Albanese and why Mrs King, the Transport Minister, did not take the decision to approve the application by Qatar. And that is a public policy question that I think is very much worthy of scrutiny. 

Steve Cannane: Okay, Paul Fletcher, good to talk. Thanks for your time.

Paul Fletcher: Thanks, Steve.